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El Daro

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Всё же надо понимать, что для них вы такие же ноунеймы, как и они для вас на БФ. Они крутятся в своей экосистеме и знать не знают о каких-то там patagonia dreams или AnimaSola. Оба множества игроков с БФ/МТ и мутаций практически не пересекаются.

Admins & "pros" are now stacking these servers
You should add links to particular players you are talking about and also specify server and time.
 

Chris

Пользователь
Всё же надо понимать, что для них вы такие же ноунеймы, как и они для вас на БФ. Они крутятся в своей экосистеме и знать не знают о каких-то там patagonia dreams или AnimaSola. Оба множества игроков с БФ/МТ и мутаций практически не пересекаются.


You should add links to particular players you are talking about and also specify server and time.
I did that and the admin is deleting my comments on the forum, what kind of nonsense is that? Anybody can search the recent ban list https://zozo.gg/sourcebans/index.php?p=banlist
over 20 bans against people attacking the losing team from tic tac for "team stacking" in 24 hours, whilst he was stacking & sitting on a team with 2500 points lead. I fully expect this comment to be deleted when he sees it. Antiquarian wouldn't have stood for this behaviour.
 

patagonia

Пользователь
Chris, maybe you meant bf servers, if you have some exp playing there you surely understand that common noobs make common mistakes but bf servers are all about some special tactics and if someone is failng then it's going to ruine the game for its team, it's very critical on bf servers to play defined way and there are very defined moments for very defined actions and if noob is failng there, he is leaving no point to play round further, on other modded servers noob's mistakes can be compensated by further play, but on bf they are no tolerated. Maybe you still don't get this tactics that attacking last ones at the end of round is a bad idea - but at the beggining of the game it is the opposite. I don't get what you mean about points but I have huge exp playing on zozo and never saw that player) specially balansing or something like that. Another thing that only higher rank players can kick so others usually asks them to kick.
 

Chris

Пользователь
Chris, maybe you meant bf servers, if you have some exp playing there you surely understand that common noobs make common mistakes but bf servers are all about some special tactics and if someone is failng then it's going to ruine the game for its team, it's very critical on bf servers to play defined way and there are very defined moments for very defined actions and if noob is failng there, he is leaving no point to play round further, on other modded servers noob's mistakes can be compensated by further play, but on bf they are no tolerated. Maybe you still don't get this tactics that attacking last ones at the end of round is a bad idea - but at the beggining of the game it is the opposite. I don't get what you mean about points but I have huge exp playing on zozo and never saw that player) specially balansing or something like that. Another thing that only higher rank players can kick so others usually asks them to kick.
Yes BF servers, but no, you're not understanding me. I've played on zozo for a little over 4 years, I know how things are. Noobs were not making mistakes. I joined on the winning team with a 3000 point advantage - as in the scores per team were 3000 points apart - and the admin (tic tac) and several "pros" on my team were screaming on mic and in chat not to attack the losing team because they did not want auto-balance - auto balance is a plugin on BF servers which balances teams if needed.

The admin was "banning" (not kicking, a votekick is completely different to an admin ban) players (both noobs and good players) one after another for attacking the losing team because they did not want the auto-balance plugin to "kick in". This is blatant misuse of his admin privileges and ruins the integrity of these servers. Without anybody (Antiq) overseeing these "admins" they're abusing their privileges in order to stack games and punishing those who refuse to stack / unbalance games. Utterly pathetic.

If you've never seen the player tic tac then a quick look at the player list would help, as he's listed as number 2 in rank on BF servers and is an active admin here. Though, if you don't play there and don't know of the balance system in place then, with respect, I'm not sure what insight your post could possibly provide.

The sad part is, tic tac is a reasonably good player. He doesn't need to stack games or create unbalance. Totally unnecessary.
 

El Daro

Пользователь
Auto-balance... auto-balance... let me see... oh, you mean this auto-balance! Sorry to disappoint you.
Auto-balance that we deserved.jpg
 

Chris

Пользователь
Auto-balance... auto-balance... let me see... oh, you mean this auto-balance! Sorry to disappoint you.
Respectfully, this has no relevance to my post. There's a huge difference between auto-balance not working correctly (it happens) and admins going out of their way to deliberately stop the plugin initialising at round end. The latter essentially "rigging" the game and should be treated as such.
 

El Daro

Пользователь
this has no relevance to my post
Yes, it does. If you've been playing for four years now, you should know that in most cases things gets worse after team balance. In best case it would've swapped noobs, making no difference to the game.

However, I'm not implying that that was the case. Moreover, I don't even know what really happened back there. All we have is a story from your perspective, to which we still have some questions. For example, did he clearly say that he doesn't want balance or was he just telling not to attack at the back? How many decent players were in your team? And in the opposite team? What map were you playing with 2500 points lead? 2500 is already enough for a 4-map campaign with perfect surviving of the team in each map, not talking about the '2500 points lead'.

And last, but not least: tic tac uses 'team stacking' statement for various occasions, that are often have nothing in common with what you mean by 'team stacking'. In many cases it just means something like 'team slowing' or 'doing stupid things'. Difficulties in translation, I guess, plus he just doesn't have time to come up with some good reason in English in the middle of the game.
 

Chris

Пользователь
Yes, it does. If you've been playing for four years now, you should know that in most cases things gets worse after team balance. In best case it would've swapped noobs, making no difference to the game.

However, I'm not implying that that was the case. Moreover, I don't even know what really happened back there. All we have is a story from your perspective, to which we still have some questions. For example, did he clearly say that he doesn't want balance or was he just telling not to attack at the back? How many decent players were in your team? And in the opposite team? What map were you playing with 2500 points lead? 2500 is already enough for a 4-map campaign with perfect surviving of the team in each map, not talking about the '2500 points lead'.

And last, but not least: tic tac uses 'team stacking' statement for various occasions, that are often have nothing in common with what you mean by 'team stacking'. In many cases it just means something like 'team slowing' or 'doing stupid things'. Difficulties in translation, I guess, plus he just doesn't have time to come up with some good reason in English in the middle of the game.

To be honest, it's not that big of a deal to me to have to go recalling and discussing the topic over and over, I haven't been the most active on zozo these past few months as there really aren't many good players anymore. I thought it worth mentioning as people here are blatantly abusing their admin rights, and it's getting worse the more they get away with it. No question.

Often, team balance can swap noobs, more often than not, however, this isn't the case. At the time of my original post any other admin could have taken a quick look at the logs and seen that several players were specifically telling the team not to attack because of auto balance - I don't mean not attack the back - they were demanding that the whole team not attack any of the survivors at all and banned anybody who did attack. I called them out on it and explained that they're making a mockery of the server blocking the auto-balance plugin, which was met with laughter (I can only assume some people just love an easy game). They can't even be bothered to reply to comments on the forum, which speaks volumes, but they're more than happy to delete my comments.

We had around 6 reasonably good players, the only notable player off memory on the other team was KoT, who also was complaining about balance, I believe. In retaliation several players on the losing team did not move from the start of the map (and I don't blame them tbh). So it was kind of a standoff of one team not attacking to prevent auto-balance, and the other team not moving forward to force auto-balance, it was ridiculous. We were playing The Parish at around 3000 v 300 give or take.

Honestly, putting one reason for all bans is just sloppy administrating and renders "catching" repeat offenders of anything impossible, but that's his choice, I guess. That was not the case here though. Players were being banned for attacking, plain and simple.

There were 117 pages of bans in the 8 years Antiq was active. That's roughly 15 per year. In the 1 year since he was last active, they've managed to rack up a further 77 pages of bans, that's a 400%+ increase. almost all with the same given reasons. This is extremely excessive in comparison. It's clear just by looking at the logs of mass bans, some seconds apart, that this is being abused, often to just "boot out" new players.
 
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El Daro

Пользователь
At the time of my original post any other admin could have taken a quick look at the logs and seen that several players were specifically telling the team not to attack because of auto balance
It is still visible until 26.05.19. And as I can see players in the opposite team were talking about not going forward, thus forcing auto-balance. Which is why some players in your team were telling the others not to attack. Here in Russia we have a saying for that: "Тупое говно тупого говна". I guess it's not really translateable.
They can't even be bothered to reply to comments on the forum, which speaks volumes, but they're more than happy to delete my comments.
The ones deleting your comments are not the ones you were playing with. There are different responsibilities between the admins on servers and the ones on forum.
We were playing The Parish at around 3000 v 300 give or take.
With such a big margin I guess there was auto-balance after each previous map. And I also guess that it didn't do much good at all.
I can also guess that you were talking about this player. This is not exactly tic tac. By the way, I didn't find anything about balance in his chat history. And the only words about balance from tac tica were as follows:
2019-05-25_01-37-02.png
It can be translated as 'stop trying to [deliberately] balance it' and it was addressed to the opposite team.
There were 117 pages of bans in the 8 years Antiq was active. That's roughly 15 per year. In the 1 year since he was last active, they've managed to rack up a further 77 pages of bans, that's a 400%+ increase.
Consider them as players with gutling-kick-gun. Because most of this 10mins bans for the same reasons are just kicks here-and-now. It is even five minutes shorter than a regular kick.

P.S. This plugin is triggered by a 40% difference in score after each map and by 35% difference in score after a whole campaign. Difference is calculated like this: mod((team1_score - team2_score) / max_score_for_this_map). For example, if winning team reached 945 points in the end of c5m4_quarter and loosing one reached 220 points, it would be calculated like this: (945 - 220) / 1050 = 0.69 => auto-balance kicks in.
 

Chris

Пользователь
It is still visible until 26.05.19. And as I can see players in the opposite team were talking about not going forward, thus forcing auto-balance. Which is why some players in your team were telling the others not to attack. Here in Russia we have a saying for that: "Тупое говно тупого говна". I guess it's not really translateable.

The ones deleting your comments are not the ones you were playing with. There are different responsibilities between the admins on servers and the ones on forum.

With such a big margin I guess there was auto-balance after each previous map. And I also guess that it didn't do much good at all.
I can also guess that you were talking about this player. This is not exactly tic tac. By the way, I didn't find anything about balance in his chat history. And the only words about balance from tac tica were as follows:
It can be translated as 'stop trying to [deliberately] balance it' and it was addressed to the opposite team.

Consider them as players with gutling-kick-gun. Because most of this 10mins bans for the same reasons are just kicks here-and-now. It is even five minutes shorter than a regular kick.

P.S. This plugin is triggered by a 40% difference in score after each map and by 35% difference in score after a whole campaign. Difference is calculated like this: mod((team1_score - team2_score) / max_score_for_this_map). For example, if winning team reached 945 points in the end of c5m4_quarter and loosing one reached 220 points, it would be calculated like this: (945 - 220) / 1050 = 0.69 => auto-balance kicks in.
This is getting tiresome now...

I can't imagine why any other admin would have any reason to delete my comments, I wasn't offensive.

Players were literally saying "do not attack and there will be no balance" admin included and banning players for doing so, I was there I watched him kick player after player for attacking. If one team wants to stand still then that's their choice, but don't ban players for simply attacking - they're doing what they're supposed to do. Ban or kick the players who are refusing to move forward (this is what a responsible admin would have done and would have solved the problem immediately with one kick, and a warning to the rest), it's completely backwards and I'd wager the players who were kicked have no idea why they were kicked.

The response by the winning team of "oh well we won't attack either then" is utterly ridiculous, juvenile and only leads to a stalemate (I don't understand how everybody doesn't see this as utterly idiotic) none of this nonsense should happen in the first place if there is an admin on the server. I personally wasn't attacking the back, and still was told to leave the survivors alone repeatedly. Why should anybody dictate how I can and cannot play with the threat of a ban? The game is supposed to be fun, for everybody.

No, I wasn't referring to tac tica, I'm aware of that player too. Tic tac uses voice comms so no logs, as do most of the toxic regulars - they're not stupid, they know that chat is logged and voice isn't, hence the mass abuse, racism, and intolerable toxicity that now seems rampant on these servers.

The fact that the bans are 10 minutes and not 15 is irrelevant. If they're using a ban to circumvent the votekick waiting time then that's bs. That's exactly why there's a waiting time in the first place, to prevent kick abuse. This is ignoring the fact that many players who are "banned" will attempt to reenter the server immediately, see they're banned and never return again. This is counter-productive if zozo actually wants players to continue playing here.

Now, there's no point in continuing a discussion that will lead nowhere. I've pretty much said all I came here to say. So that's that.
 

El Daro

Пользователь
The response by the winning team of "oh well we won't attack either then" is utterly ridiculous, juvenile and only leads to a stalemate (I don't understand how everybody doesn't see this as utterly idiotic)
Does anybody argue this?
Why should anybody dictate how I can and cannot play with the threat of a ban? The game is supposed to be fun, for everybody.
Or this?
Tic tac uses voice comms
Should've mentioned that in the first place.
 

emzy

Staff member
Admins & "pros" are now stacking these servers, encouraging others to stack and forcefully admin kicking and votekicking anybody who attacks the losing team because they do not want autobalance. These servers are not what they used to be.

To be fair (and I'm not trying to be rude here), this is a complaint forum. I placed a complaint - generally aimed towards admins. I didn't expect a discussion with a player who wasn't there.
'Team stacking' is just one of the common reasons that are used for short 10-30 minutes bans.
It has nothing to do with what you described. Players banned for this reason were just kicked here and now. Although 'team flashing' would be more correct.

Those messages were not deleted. There were an attempt to merge them in one message and it failed because some part of the text was lost.
 

Chris

Пользователь
'Team stacking' is just one of the common reasons that are used for short 10-30 minutes bans.
It has nothing to do with what you described. Players banned for this reason were just kicked here and now. Although 'team flashing' would be more correct.

Those messages were not deleted. There were an attempt to merge them in one message and it failed because some part of the text was lost.
This was established via El Daro's responses. I still think the amount of kicks to new players is very excessive and unreasonable, that's just my opinion.

Only my original complaint was deleted. One comment. I have no idea what anybody was attempting to"merge" it with, but ok.

The solution and conclusion I have come to is to simply avoid servers 1-4 if possible. Thanks anyway.
 

Aiva

Пользователь
Дайте иммунитет от киков на танковой мутации, латиносы там захватили власть).
Твой ранг низкий, так что советую скрыть ранг на Этом серве, плюс будь общительным и найдешь у них общий язык)))
 
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